Calls for guarantees over Scots air links with London

Monday, 30 January 2012 21:25
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Speaking during a debate on the Civil Aviation Bill at Westminster on Monday, SNP MP Pete Wishart called for the UK Government to seek guarantees over the future of Scottish air links following the acquisition of British Midland (BMI) by International Airlines Group (IAG) which owns British Airways.

The SNP MP highlighted research which shows BA's record between Scotland and Heathrow lags behind a more punctual BMI – raising further concerns that the quality of service for Scottish passengers would deteriorate as well as the number of services following the takeover.

On flights between London Heathrow and the three main Scottish airports, BA consistently shows a greater average delay in flights than BMI.  On flights between Glasgow and Heathrow, BA has an average delay of 13.5 minutes, as against an average for 9.7 minutes on BMI flights.  Similar figures were reported on flights between Edinburgh and Heathrow.  

Mr Wishart said:

"Research shows that BA's record lags behind a more punctual BMI which will reinforce fears, with this takeover, that passengers could be left with a poorer quality service as well as a reduced number of flight options.

"The UK Government must seek guarantees over the future of Scottish air links following this take over by BA of its primary domestic rival.

"There is a real worry that BA will give its international slots at Heathrow priority over domestic services – and Scottish passengers must not be left with a second class service.

"We have already seen the loss of valuable air links between Scotland and Heathrow, and if BA takes over its only rival, then remaining slots will clearly be at risk. We must have real guarantees that further domestic slots will not be withdrawn."

Comments  

 
# UpSpake 2012-01-31 09:48
When Scotland is independent, a slot at Heathrow will be an international one for those who have a need to visit London.
 
 
# Robert Louis 2012-01-31 10:01
The importance of connections to Heathrow cannot be overstated. International business travellers often come in through Heathrow, and do not want to haul luggage to the likes of Stansted or Luton, just to get to Scotland.

The difficulty with BA now having a monopoly on these Scottish routes to London is also due to something called baggage interlining. BA is a part of the 'oneworld' alliance, and if you check in your luggage at Edinburgh, they will ensure your luggage is connected to your long haul flight from Heathrow - but only if it is via BA or a oneworld carrier, such as quantas.

BMI was part of the 'Star alliance', with relationships for baggage interlining to many other airlines such as United Airlines, Lufthansa and Virgin Atlantic. BA will NOT transfer you luggage to ANY of those airlines which are NOT in the Oneworld group.

Just to explain, if you are connecting to a long haul flight at Heathrow from Scotland, and your luggage isn't getting interlined for you by the airline, then at Heathrow you need to collect your luggage at the carousel, go back out landside, then take your luggage to your next airline check in area (maybe in another terminal) check you luggage in, then go back through security once again. If your luggage is being interlines, you merely stay airside, and go to your new departure gate or terminal, but do not have to check in again, and do not have to collect and re-check your baggage.

In addition, f you are not 'interlined', and your flight arrives late from Scotland to Heathrow, and you miss your longhaul flight, then the longhaul carrier will accept NO responsibility.

Losing a Star alliance carrier to Heathrow from Scotland, does not just affect competition, it affects many, many other aspects of encouraging business travel to Scotland.

I frankly cannot believe that BA has been allowed to literally cease any competition to London Heathrow from Scotland. Of course with a monopoly to Heathrow, BA will be free to charge as much as they like for flights from Scotland.

The slots have ben purchased by BA from BMI, so even if a competitor wanted to run a service to Heathrow, they wouldn't be able to, as there would be no slots available.

Wholly uncompetitive.
 
 
# MickDee 2012-01-31 11:12
I believe that BMI isn't disappearing completely. BMI Regional is to carry on operating out of Scotland. I'm sure that once they pull out of Heathrow they will be looking to enhance connectability through other European hubs.
 
 
# Holebender 2012-01-31 13:30
If your journey is all on the one ticket there should be no problem checking baggage right through to your final destination, regardless of the carriers involved.

BMI used to charge extra for checked in baggage on domestic flights, do they still do that?
 
 
# Aplinal 2012-01-31 20:18
I travel quite a lot - maybe 6 - 10 international flights a year. As it is not always possible to have one carrier for some destinations I often have multiple carriers. The luggage has never been as issue for me - it has always been logged through to the final destination.

However, it IS true that unless you have one carrier throughout, there is NO guarantee that anyone will pick up the 'tab' if there is a delay with one carrier not linked to the second.

Scotland is poorly served as it is, the refusal to transfer the DPA (if I have that right) to Scotland is just another petty snipe by Westminster to make our lives as difficult as possible. It will all be different after independence, as I think that dropping DPA will encourage MORE carriers to fly in direct to one of the Scottish airports.
 
 
# Robert Louis 2012-01-31 20:36
Just checked and two authoritative sources told me two different answers, so I'd better say no more in case I get sued.
 
 
# Robert Louis 2012-01-31 10:08
One more thing.

In my experience when their are problems at Heathrow, with delays and so on. The very first flights which BA used to cancel were the Scottish connections, whilst sometimes BMI kept running. That is my experience, and I was once told that BA in such circumstances prioritised their international flights.
 
 
# Triangular Ears 2012-01-31 10:41
I've heard this too. More of the London respect agenda eh?

To the poster on the other thread who said his friends worried about connceting flights to London after independence, perhaps you should point them to this thread.
 
 
# Robert Louis 2012-01-31 10:51
Exactly. The problem exists right now, whilst within the union.
 
 
# CapnAndy 2012-01-31 21:00
RL.
Yes, unfortunately this seems to be the case, I've been caught by this a number of times and it's very frustrating. If I know the weather is a bit dodgy I collect my luggage at Heathrow and if the flights are OK, check it back in again. If the flights are off I can get the train or hire a motor.
Worst of it is, I actually like to fly BA and far I prefer Heathrow to Amsterdam. I was told recently that even BAs own pilots are hacked off with the Scottish connections as many of them live up here.
 
 
# MickDee 2012-01-31 11:07
Unless you absolutely have to go to Heathrow, you should try Frankfurt for travel to foreign destinations. I transited through there last month and found it a far better experience than Heathrow. Clean and efficient. Schipol is also a better alternative. This would be a good way for Scotland to build bridges with other countries in Europe.
 
 
# Holebender 2012-01-31 13:32
Personally I try to avoid London as much as possible. I book flights via Amsterdam or Paris wherever possible and now that Lufthansa has started a scheduled service to Aberdeen I can add Frankfurt to my list of preferred hubs.
 
 
# Aplinal 2012-01-31 20:19
Agreed, Heathrow is a nightmare. I haven't flown into LHR for about 5 years.
 
 
# Robert Louis 2012-02-01 10:36
I don't really rate KLM as being on the same level as BA.

Lufthansa is however good, but if you are going East, it is nuts to fly to Frankfurt. It only makes sense for places like Asia/Europe.
 
 
# freeussoon 2012-01-31 20:35
Good old BA. Travelled three times to different destinations,an d luggage delayed/sent to another airport and finally lost one bag!

I may be unlucky? but decided that perhaps BA would NOT be my carrier of choice again.
 
 
# lumilumi 2012-01-31 21:17
Sorry, haven't read all the comments, just the story, and this struck me: "There is a real worry that BA will give its international slots at Heathrow priority over domestic services."

Weep weep. Or duh! If and when Scotland becomes independent, shuttle services between Scottish airports and Heathrow (or other English/Welsh airports) are international flights. So effining what?

The English still apparently don't realise that you can actually travel to Scotland without going via London/England. The last few times I've been in Scotland, I got a direct flight from Scandinavia to Edinburgh. But London don't want to know.
 
 
# Lucas 2012-02-01 00:01
I'd prefer to use Schipol for onward air travel rather than Heathrow - it's just so much more pleasant to use
 
 
# Robert Louis 2012-02-01 10:32
Quoting Lucas:
I'd prefer to use Schipol for onward air travel rather than Heathrow - it's just so much more pleasant to use




Hmmm. Schipol used to be very good. Lately I think they have become lazy or complacent. I know several people who have had endless difficulties getting their luggage back, after it was lost in Schipol recently.

Having said that, Charles De Gaull, which used to be worse than Heathrow or JFK, has actually improved substantially

It;'s all very well talking of London as not important to an independent Scotland, but even with a YES vote, it won't happen for real until 2016. In the meantime, Scotland needs good airlinks, so giving BA a monopoly on Heathrow routes is very bad for Scotland.

Sure getting direct routes from Scotland is good, but in the here and now business travellers needs choice to Heathrow, or else BA can charge whatever they wish to charge. BA flies to T5, the only flights out of T5 are BA flights.
 
 
# CapnAndy 2012-02-01 17:01
RL.
I fully agree.
I've been trying not to say anything about Schipol as I've ranted about it enough times on this site. It is simply awful. Heathrow has its faults but for service it beats Schipol hands down. I also agree regarding Paris, still not great, but getting better.
In the long term though, what is needed is to close Glasgow and Edinburgh airports and open a good size airport between the two.
Yeah, pie in the sky maybe, but Scotland is on the route from England and Europe to the US and Canada. With the right connections it would be in the right place to be a major hub airport.
 
 
# Ken500 2012-02-01 20:48
Anywhere but Heathrow.

BA has priority slots and cheaper costs for slots, cutting out any competition.
 
 
# rapid 2012-02-04 14:05
I like many other Scots are very frequent flyers between Scotland and London; Since BMI stopped it's glasgow service at the end of last year, BA's business tickets for a day return down from glasgow to london on the 0700hrs and back in the evening have soared to around £500.

EDI's prices are a lower (possibly because there is competition), hovering around £330 on a routedeal for the 0630 BMI flight and back in the evening.

My worry is that BA will up the prices - making scottish firms (like mine) uncompetitive.
 
 
# UpSpake 2012-02-04 15:02
CapnAndy. Good idea but in truth, should have been done 30 years ago but then there was a stranglehold on developments in air traffic in Scotland. Afraid the infrastrucuture is now too embedded to allow for the sensible option you propose.
 
 
# CapnAndy 2012-02-06 00:05
Upspake.
I know. But to dream, perchance to dream.
 

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